@ned & @dantheman DUMP 50,500 STEEM on Market today! WTF is going on?!
As we all sit here trying to build steem and support the project, Ned and Dan (two founders of Steemi) are transferring to Poloniex and dumping all over the buy orders killing the price. Why are they doing this? This needs to be stopped!!!
Anyone have any ideas what is going on here? Is it time to get out while we can?
Ned trying to bury a post on his own website by paying 600 bucks. Welcome to a new era!
Here are screenshots of the action. Pay attention folks, what you are seeing here is something that happens in mainstream media all the time: creating buzz on other subjects to divert the attention from another, more problematic, news story. Nice to see this happen in a controlled environment.
Interesting. If it's another forum, the post would have been removed/moderated already.
Keeping the discussion in the platform is good.
I thought it might have been Ned being generous before seeing this, but the timing and amount is curious. Is there much wrong with it? The idea of post promotion is partly a competitive payment to get higher on the ladder.
As of right now, this post sits at #5 on the promoted page, and if anyone promotes this post by just 1.01 SBD it will sit at #3 and soon sit at #2.
edit: fixed positions because I was viewing promoted posts only in #steemit
I think the question isn't whether this was right or wrong, this would be creating a false dichotomy. There are usually as many views of right or wrong as there are people judging a specific case. Beside OP is arguably FUD so it's not like reducing its visibility was entirely undeserved.
The real point was that what happened here was extremely manipulative, in the same kind of way we usually reproach to mainstream media and the private interests and powerful bureaucrats that control them.
The last few years in the crypto world have shown that the exact same crap that happens in the real world economy has happened in crypto markets: pumps and dumps, market manipulation, insider trading, money laundering, cartels, scammy IPOs, large scale ponzi schemes, money supply debasing, attempt at co-opting power by self-appointed influence groups, herding, mass hysteria, panick, fear and greed all around... Crypto is a fascinating sandbox that helps understanding what's going on in the real economy, how greedy and ignorant economic actors are and how truely clueless economists and central banks really are.
With the advent of crypto based content publishing and social media platforms like Steem, we are now going to be able to observe all the panel of tactics used by government agencies, large corporates and mainstream media to attempt manipulate the public opinion and their effect. We will also have the opportunity to experiment with counter-tactics like trying to make things backfire for wannabe manipulators.
It's from that perspective that I find what Ned did here absolutely fascinating. This is the kind of stuff you find in Machiavelli's "The Prince" and Robert Greene's "48 Laws of Power". And I expect that we will see more and more of that coming from every directions. This is going to be very interesting, and provide a lot of insight about what's happening in the world at large.
thats a pretty ridiculous statement. What ned did was manage the news -- In a manner so transparent and hamfisted that its apparent to every single person who looks at this post (which i think is linked on a bunch of forums as well) knows whats going on.
Lets review exactly what happened here.
He made whats probably a completely innocuous WD.
then someone posted about it.
So he spends like a thousand bucks to try to move the post down, because its one where he just can't use his vote to hide.
That is to say, he spent $1000 to wreck his credibility and probably chased off a ton of buyers, for the sake of what? Not having to come here and explain whats probably an innocuous transaction (50K isnt market breaking). Also, he proved that promoting a post (a feature he just introduced) is absolutely worthless, because whales will just pump money into other posts in order to achieve the same effect they do with voting in other views.
thats not realpolitik. Its just real bad business.
ALso, just as a PS to the conversation about Ned and Dan as genius realpolitik masterminds,
Did anyone notice the new voting thing was buried in "bug fixes" right under "clean up @null"
I think it is fascinating from a psychological perspective. I think the real question is: what would you do? I had some nasty posts created by tuck and the fryss lately. I ignored them because they upset me. I am not used to attention, especially negative attention. I am not into stirring the pot, but I am not a sheeple either. When it comes to someone else suffering, and the cause of the suffering is BAD DESIGN, well, then, I cannot be quiet.
But I also know when I am wrong and I did apologize to Dan. I should never have mentioned the email, but I was MAD. I also felt that the most vulnerable people are ignored, and I knew I would have to bring visibility to the issue if we were to ever have anything change.
Steemit is a centralized website with a clear power structure. But the fact that we all can see whatever we wish to research on here is a rare peek into psychological worlds that we never have had access to.
Excellently written. Couldn't agree more
Blah 48 Laws of Power, literally a book on how to get rich and powerful in the greasiest ways possible lol.
Done but its at #3
honestly I don't like the idea to be promoted in this way! It is only a risk because people invest their money with the hope to receive more visibility! This doesn't mean that they will score with them post because it depend from Whales. By the way here the problem is another one... and this episode scare me! :( I hope they got a new person that want invest in Steemit so they are "selling" their steem and he can buy it... but I don't know! :(
No.
Not a chance.
This post isn't worth paying to bury. With the amount of money moving around on steemit, $600 amounts to not much more than "testing our new feature."
Nice catch! How funny. Promoted works both ways!
The platform isn't going to build itself for free. They need to cash out to buy better servers, hire good developers to create more features, market, etc. Also, as @mughat pointed out, steem also needs to become available to new buyers so we can grow the user base.
If you believe in Steemit, hold on to your hat. It's going to be a bumpy ride but we can all make it by building this community and not worrying so much about early-stage price fluctuations :)
http://www.alexa.com/siteinfo/steemit.com
Here are the ingredients for a web site:
Here are the ingredients for a web site like steemit.com:
My points:
@liondani: AMEN indeed.
The day to day price of steem matters because the payouts come from demand for steem. From what I see on coinmarketcap there is no demand for steem. Steem is not currently profitable.
It doesn't matter which account it comes from. Attack the message not the messenger. The fact is, if Steemit is not profitable then all that SP will be worthless, so I have every incentive to want the price of Steem to be as high as possible because that is where my ability to profit comes from.
Steem is not currently profitable. The user base is going up while the market cap going down which means payouts decrease. If you want payouts to increase and more people to be able to get paid then Steem has to be profitable.
I never claimed I lost hope. I do my part to bring value to Steem so it becomes profitable but right now sad to say it's just not. We have to accept reality before we can change it.
I find this funny coming from an account which has made over 30k SP in 4 months and that stellabelle has voted on this comment after the Synereo post.
Also kinda sad seeing how quickly people lose hope cause of a sinking free market price. When the project and site are obviously becoming improved from day to day.
@dana-edwards
It's doing exactly what it was designed to do.
If you believe the long term price of steem is up then you hold sp.
If you believe the long term price of steem is down then you hold SBD or you power down and sell.
If whales weren't selling, then I'd be concerned. These guys really do need to be powering down and taking today's price so the price of steem is depressed enough that people in this for megabucks just go away and those of us who are here to build something can finally have a voice.
and if somehow you don't hild on your hat, you are stuck with it on your head for 104 weeks anyway so better..just enjoy the rideeeeeee
That response is illogical. This coin has a $67 million "ninjamine", 25% of which is allocated to cover development costs. The platform building itself doesn't require coins being sold out of founders' individual accounts.
I was never aware of this before. This is interesting information which can change my views. I always thought developers are cashing out to pay for living expenses and development costs?
The "ninjamine" along with the allocation and planned uses of the proceeds was described and disclosed in the original bitcointalk thread as well as here: https://steem.io/roadmap/launch-and-sale/
The 'steemit' account has already sold hundreds of thousands of dollars worth of coins, at least, presumably to cover business expenses, most apparently via privately-arranged deals with blocktrades acting as a broker rather than directly on public exchange markets, but likely some of the latter too. There is absolutely nothing wrong with having done so; it is in accordance with the stated plans.
Bullshit argument. You don't need to pay to participate on steemit. Growth in user base will have nothing to do with Steem price.
Steem is used to buy Steem power and Steem power is like equity in network and that depends on the size of the network.( really active size).
User count has everything to do with Steem demand
They have 100x that in their wallets so even if 12, 21k Steem is a lot for you and me, for them it's a tiny piece.
Plus, yeah, they needed to get some money for the servers or something or had some investor jumping in and not enough liquidity on the market.
Markets align themselves generally, look at the results of the BTS pump
Steem is currently overvalued and, I agree, it needs to get low in order for more serious shareholders to step in (the kind that pour millions in, not a few BTC).Also, this is good for the power to balance on the platform. I'm waiting for it to go waaay lower than it is right now and jump in buying strong.
Yes I think the liquid Steem plus sbd needs to rise to 10% before I'll stop powering down. Sbd seem like a nice place to park till the next phase starts. The synereo launch feedback should be interesting as well.
you could "miss the train" also....
Steem will always be over valued when you look at the fact that there is no demand for Steem. Look at the volume on coinmarket cap and you see around $100,000 a day which is next to nothing in cryptospace. Then you have Ethereum moving millions a day on promises and vapor and insecure technology.
You may be right I just concerned.
This post is inaccurate, Ned and I are almost always front run and are smarter than to dump at once.
So if the polo sale wasn't you, is some bot out there watching yours and @ned's transfers and auto-dumping when they see you make a big transfer to an exchange? That would be diabolical, and very entertaining to take advantage of.
@dantheman I apologize that I got misled by this blog post. I am now correcting my mistake. I got confused and hope not to repeat such a noob mistake again. Hope that you understand what I mean.
dumping 1% asset so as to hurt the remaining 99% is irrational.
why is this post not in the promoted section anymore? Just curious how this works...
I'm curious how this post has managed to postpone its first payout for so long. If you promote a post, does it push back the payout date?
I see it in promoted still.
When selling steem there is also a buyer. Getting new shareholder into steem is a value. Spreading the voting power is a value for the system as a whole. The price is not very important right now. Actually getting the price down to get new shareholders into the market is what we need at this moment in time. The free market is a huge value.
I´m on the buy-side and for me to buy, someone has to sell. Thank you for the "gifting" :)
Shareholders? This is crypto, your argument is invalid.
Stakeholders, shareholders, coinholders, powerholders. They are all similar concepts. What is your preferred label?
You forgot bagholders..
DAMN.
I prefer to call them dickbutts
plural works too, nice! supermegadickbutts
confused me...
This post has been linked to from another place on Steem.
STEEM REPORT SEPTEMBER, 2ND by @elyaque
JS Index update for 09/01. [2nd update] +WOW Steem(it) Founders pushing the price down! by @james-show
Learn more about linkback bot
They brought a good idea from conception to market. Why should they not get paid for it?
They haven't brought anything to market. Steemit has not generated any true revenue. All funds have come from speculative bagholders who are watching their "investment" get crushed by the founders dumping their founder coins.
If their company were earning money for coin buyers you might have a point, but it is taking money from coin buyers with continuous dumping and no true value coming out of it yet. These are brutal dumps, not responsible selling to cover expenses and pay reasonable salaries. These are the kind of dumps designed to create a market panic or worse insider trading where they know bad news is around the corner.
Devils advocate... The second a outside dollar bought a steem it was on the market.
And how can you say what constitutes reasonable salaries and reasonable expenses. As a business owner for every new engineer I hire I make sure I have $50k-100k cash on hand to front their costs, salary, and benefits before I begin to see the first cent of value out of them
I read your comment in Tone Vays voice. ;)
Theres a difference between selling and taking a shit on the market.
And that difference in perspective is... Whether you're selling or holding?
It's OK go sell, but you shouldn't do it in large chunks like that, because you eat all the buy orders all at once. Instead you need to feed the coins into the market slowly. Wait for new buy orders to be placed, slowly sell, wait again for new orders, slowly sell, etc.
Doing it in one go will eat away the orders before buyers can come in and place new ones - that's what leads to falling prices.
" the platform need money " is not an excuse for such aggressive trading action. we can solve high cash out far more smarter way. (auction, direct deal on the in-house market. ) there is plenty of options. no need to make people nervous.
This is absolutely wrong action even if its side effect of cashing out for paying cost of project. I am very unhappy when I see market disruption like this.
no excuses, bad behavior.
It is neither an excuse, nor is accurate. This coin has a $67 million "ninjamine"", 25% of which is allocated to cover development costs. The building of the platform doesn't require coins being sold out of founders' individual accounts.
No offense, it just seems sort of grasping at conspiracy theories. I'm writing and creating art over on my blog...and I'd love for @dantheman or @ned to come read some poems, feel some goodness, vote for me...but all this talk of dooms day is exhausting.
I very recently realized I was being oversensational about my own choice to leave the community and decided to stay, because at least I can get my words out and hopefully create some feels for some people. But shit like this is just burdensome and exhausting and talk about attention being turned from posts that matter....this sort of drama is exactly what detracts from artists here who are trying to get some feelings out there and hoping to pay for groceries this week as a result.
So no offense intended and hope you get to feeling better about it all.
@ned and @dantheman or @dan or whoever it is founding this site...come brethren, come read poetry! hahahaha, I know, shameless self promotion!
Namaste everyone.