RE: Something I'd really like people to understand... disagreement is good. Don't so quickly consider it trolling.
@tarazkp did a good post on the topic, I guess you read it but just in case
https://steemit.com/philosophy/@tarazkp/how-serious-are-you
I can understand anyone that is emotional about his political views. So am I. But that should only fuel the passion for constructive arguing, it should not make you try to shut up anyone who begs to differ.
A nice thing Taraz only briefly touched on: in a discussion both sides are most likely wrong. Even we "redpilled" people need to get our information from somewhere and its most of the time not our own eyes and ears. We get told what to think by alternative media outlets, it is not intrinsically better than established media. Sure you could argue alternatives provide more facts and msm only paddles emotions. But especially lately many alternative outlets devolve into a broken record repeating emotional parols like White Genocide, Rapefugees, etc. .... .
Ergo you cant really come from a high horse when discussing with someone that watches msm.
I don't try to come from a high horse at all. I just share information and poke at things where I can.
My main thing here is that if a person indicates they are done. Let them go. If you don't seem to have accomplished anything, you may not have appeared to, but later on it could actually matter to that person.
It is very rare that you'll change a mind right when you are talking to them. Especially if it is something important to them. They need time to go and process and think. The same is true for whatever they shared with you. You also need time to think and process.
So people that get frustrated because they don't think they are getting through to the person shouldn't worry about that. It is impossible to tell if you got through and it'll just take awhile to soak in or not.
I read a lot of @tarazkp's works. I'll check to see if that is one I miss or not.
Yet I was not really talking about seriousness in this article, more the idea that you can't really tell if what you said mattered or not. The person you spoke to may not even know yet.
Taraz talks about general discussion culture as well. He does not spend too much time on the humor part.
"if they are not willing to take the position that they may be wrong, in my opinion, they are not serious at all." is a quote from his article that seems pretty fitting to your topic ;)
Yeah... I replied and resteemed. I hadn't seen that article so thanks for pointing it out.
We must have been drinking the same kool aid today or something.
I'll talk to someone that is in the position that they can't be wrong. I've many times seen these people regurgitating MY IDEAS they wouldn't listen to as their own days, weeks, or months later. It has happened to me many times.
It was usually in big corporate work environments. I often had management when I was a peon steal my ideas and pass them off as their own too. My coworkers would point it out. "Hey, Deva isn't that what you were talking about the other day and now he's treating it like it is his idea."
I've had some VERY stubborn people that disagreed with me strongly within a year or so of some discussion with me that they appeared to in no way believe me, I'd hear them speaking with someone else having a discussion and be pushing the idea I tried to get them to understand.
I just inwardly smile.
I am sure I have also understood things people were talking to me about much later and not even remembered where it came from. So I don't care that people remember me talking to them about things.
I just like to learn new things, and I also like to share ideas with people.
I think that is the down side of critical thinking. You wont accept an idea unless you consider it your own. This is true for myself as well. Most of the times when "I agree!", I do so because I already had similar thoughts on my own.
If I get presented with a completely new idea or an idea that does not fit into my narrative, I think the best you could get out of me would be "interesting, I will look more into it"
I don't do this because I think it is a great way to debate, it is not. I am just trying to observe my own tendencies so I am aware of them.
Yeah sometimes ideas take awhile to make sense. Our minds are pretty rigid things, so making big changes takes a bit.