Am I stupid?
Delegating Steem Power out for free? What the F! Words from someone who is either stupid, or just cares for Steem/Steemit.
pixabay source
Delegating to the engaged
For me, comments(replies) are the grease that oils the Blockchain here on Steemit. Without them, no matter how epic the post is, things would look pretty sad.
In fact, many high earning posts look pretty sad. Reasons for lack of engagement in the replies could be down to a few things:
- A shit post
- An author that frequently doesn't respond to comments
- Post is so good that words can't describe
Of course there are many low earning posts without much engagement, but the reasons for that would also include:
- Lack of exposure
Anyway, back to delegation and my question in the title of the post.
For months now, I've been following a trend, i'll even say a growing trend just to fluff it up a bit - I don't know if it's growing, but there are a few people around who have been or are currently, delegating their Steem Power to other users for $0 - Free - Nothing at all.
Here are a few of these people off the top of my head. If you are someone delegating SP for nothing and reading this post, let me know so I can add you to my awesome people list.
@stellabelle, @steevec, @fulltimegeek, @paulag, @tarazkp, @techslut, @wwf, @carlgnash, @cheneats, @coolguy123, @cranium, @crimsonclad, @drakos, @flauwy, @goldendawne, @hendrix22, @hitmeasap, @howtostartablog, @inquiringtimes, @kubbyelizabeth, @lyndsaybowes, @old-guy-photos, @skycae, @taskmaster4450, @karensuestudios, @aggroed, @simplymike ...
I choose to delegate my Steem Power to people who are engaging here on Steemit. A weekly league, which is open to all is produced with some not so secret metrics, and the top places/most in need of a boost, recieve a little delegated Steem Power.
Names on the list above may have chosen to review this list or not, it doesn't really matter - they are delegating their Steem Power out for absolutely nothing.
So I guess my question is better put: Are we stupid?
Delegating to Bid-bots
In light of the well advertised recent delegation by a mega-whale @thejohalfiles to one of the newer Bid-bots, @smartsteem, I thought I'd have a look at what this delgation means financially to this account, and what this could do for me too.
In brief, it's possible to delegate your Steem Power to a 'Bid-bot', which will then pay you interest on this amount (daily in most cases), which varies depending on how much the Bot takes each day. If you haven't looked, they take a lot - meaning, the 'Bidding rounds' are almost always full, and not just that, they are usually oversubscribed. In short, they are making a $hiteload of SBD/STEEM, and can afford to pay their delegates handsomely.
This is the calculation estimate for @thejohalfiles:
No, you didn't read it wrong, it does actually say 1060 SBD a day
Is it any surprise that he's sacked off the day job for a passive daily income of $3776?
So what does that calculation look like to me?
Daily: 8.9 SBD / $31.6
Weekly: 62.3 / $221.8
Monthly: 267.1 / $950.9
(1 SBD = $3.56 at time of writing)
Almost $1000 a month, for doing absolutely nothing. Wow.
Instead though, I'm paying for 4000 delegated Steem Power (at a really good rate of 40 STEEM a month), and delegating almost all of it out, for nothing. On top of that:
Oops. Duh?!
My curation rewards (the other income option for your Steem Power) are looking like they will be 10-15 Steem Power (not SBD) a week, (which is vested STEEM) and a little lower than the price of SBD at present, so let's take the highest value and calculate what this return is for a month:
15 x 4 x $3.47 = $208
A bit of a mismatch there?
Again, you can't blame some accounts for switching to this income stream - it's almost 500% more lucrative in my case.
Now, you may be wondering where I'm going with this, and I do want an honest answer to the post title, but I would like to say first:
Short term pain, long term gain
I'll continue delegating my Steem Power and continue to give more of it out to those that are here greasing the chain, making me laugh, producing work that is worth sharing, commenting, and encouraging people to do the best they can.
I don't ask for a vote from these accounts, I just ask them to contribute to a making this place better.
Nope, I'm not stupid, I just give a shit about Steemit.
Asher @abh12345
Thanks Asher! That was pretty Awesome.
Thank you.
I tried to be open and honest and make clear that i'm here first to make this place work, over the money - I'm hoping that will come later when we've got a flourishing platform :)
Why not both? Stupid and caring. :)
Those asking how to get a delegation? Simple:
That's all. I've never asked for upvotes or my fat delegation (which I got from a "stupid" whale who rather not be tagged). I don't use bidbots at all, and if I really want the extra promotion, I use minnowbooster. I try to be kind and nice to anyone who contacts me - I help with advice and answers, and those I feel have the potential to flourish on the platform - get some extra loving from me.
Since I live off a fat free delegation myself, I think it is my duty to pass around that love. So most of my natural SP is delegated out to new users (steeminvite, why you no work again?!), promising bloggers and local Israeli newbies who need the bandwidth.
Also, I like to consider myself Chief Emergency SP Injector in cases of low bandwidth for at least 3 groups - @teamgirlpowa @steemsugars and @isleofwrite . I get tagged in general, and whoever needs the 20 SP to get through their first few weeks - I am happy to give it.
(Self upvoted for visibility)
and we thank you nit just for sp help but flagging and just plsin arguing skillfully on our behalf!!!! #techslutfan4life
<3
I am just being me. It's all I know how to do.
To everyone who is asking how to be successful in Steemit this pretty much sums it up. Short, Sweet and simple even stupid like me gets it.
I have been a recepient of some of the upvotes that you give out and I feel motivated to write more and connect more to people.
Each time I get upvoted is one more chance for me to pay-it-forward and upvote someone else and inspire them to keep Steemining no matter how hard things are at times.
Awesome :)
You really do some awesome work and I'm glad you boosted yourself to the top with this comment!
Stupid and caring, awww, that does sound like me!
Continue being ace, thank you!
I want to live in a world ruled by the stupid and caring, rather than one run by the smart and indifferent.
Yes!
I wonder if we'll ever make it back onto league 1 again - got delegations coming out of my ears now!
Oh I've given up a while ago. How many is it now? 18? 20?
So many fans. @limabeing, are you opening a fan club?
and yea, you're awesome Ilana, I have a question tho, what's Asher's curation guild?
https://steemit.com/steemit/@abh12345/58vhut-steemit-the-curation-leagues-sbd-and-delegation-prizes
League. Not guild. My bad. You should join!
hi @techslut - I'm new on Steemit - and rather new in Israel, too :) What do you mean by "Comment at least 10 insightful comments for every post." Do you mean for every post you make daily, you should at least give ten comments on other posts?
That is correct. Commenting on posts by other authors with similar interests is how you get followers. I have over 2600 because I comment a lot more than a post.
Well I appreciate your generosity and 'keeping the faith'... and I'm sticking with this 'engagement' thing myself for the time being (work and VP permitting).
Although just to put this out there.... I think all of us community minded folks need to be ready to jump ship if (1) the algorithms which incentivise self-interest over engagement don't change and (2) a similar platform with more socially aligned algorithms emerges.
While it is possible to earn a decent (second) income while engaging on here with minimum investment, it is not good for the soul to be doing so amidst such selfish carnage of the ecosystem.
This is still all a bit of a test, after all... and let's remember, in five years time, steemit probably won't be the only established blockchain based social media platform, and if this place doesn't change there may be somewhere more aligned with our values to which we can all flee.
I don't buy the argument that we need selfish rich people to make this place work. I've taught sociology way too long to know that's just utter nonsense - those are precisely the kind of people we need to keep on a leash if we want a sustainable future.
So keep the faith, try and make it work on here, but let's remember, we can just all leave if something better comes along: Pilgrim Fathers n all, or maybe that's a bad analogy....?
Of course that may all be wishful thinking, it would be painful, and a massive act of co-ordination, but it may be necessary. Also, just stating it as a possibility may make @ned actually listen to the voices wanting some kind of algorithmic limit to abuse.
Karl.
P.S. three edits, but without changing the essence of the comment. I'm sure there's a correlation between 'degree of rantiness' and 'number of typos.'
Great stuff Karl, thank you for this well written response!
I know what you mean, and the likely destination dont worry :)
And I hope that the changes in the next fork take place. I see one of them as a positive for curation rewards, which involves the author receiving no curation if they vote within 15 minutes. It could end up as a battle for that 15 minute position, but could still work out a bit better than at present.
Yes this is very true, and indeed the vision of @ned hearing him talk at Steemfest. I received a comment on discord today which was a little tongue in cheek, but suggested that the UI here was left alone (requiring changes) in the hope that something better would be developed to serve the purpose of blogging/content creation on the Steem Blockchain :)
Anyway, we shall continue on doing what we think is right, and if we end up with nothing for it, at least we tried.
Cheers!
Thanks for the updates!
Don't burn yourself out responding to people.
I reckon you've earned the right to a couple of days off and a couple of meme posts!
Ha!
Yes It's been hardcore the last few days, my own 'fault' I guess.
Perhaps I'll drop a meme in soon, although I use @zapncrap for 'topical' meme's when they spring to mind.
Thanks for the advice, heeded!
Good choice of name.
Hey @abh12345,
Delegating to support other users is an honorable and great thing to do. We all have our share of responsibility to improve the overall health of the blockchain and its ecosystem.
Delegating to SmartSteem is profitable yes - but that isn't a bad thing. We've shown we make it our number one priority to reward and empower good content and actively work on reducing abuse via whitelisting and blacklisting.
@thejohalfiles, is a very active steemian who has been curating manually for the past 2 years and is now looking for ways to reward quality-content through delegations while still making some profit of his Steempower.
He also delegates to @utopian-io and is interested in platforms such as @dlive and @dtube, so we not only trust he has the best interests of the community at heart but also feel flattered that he sees the same value on our service and trusts us to keep up our standards.
If you have any worries whatsoever, we're always available to have a chat!
Hey @therealwolf
I didn't mean for the post to be a personal attack on @smartsteem or @thejohalfiles, you are just the latest high profile delegation case and the most obvious example to use.
I have respect for @smartsteem in being the first Bid-bot to produce a white list, and as you know I have bought votes from you quite frequently recently.
However, if every account delegated to a bidbot, what would Steemit look like? The only posts receiving votes would be those where the author had paid to promote the content. Is this what we want? Surely not!?
A delegation to @utopian-io is something I have in place myself. There, each post is moderated prior to receiving the same sized vote as every other post in that category, this gives the best posts in that category a chance to shine.
They are one of the reasons I still support HF17/19s delegated SP introduction, applications like utopian-io and dtube would really struggle otherwise.
Anyway, thanks for taking the time to comment here. You don't get an upvote today though as you've already topped my blog with your own vote! That is the 2nd time this week someone has done that and I must say that it's not my favourite thing in the world! However,
As you are mentioned in the post,
It's fair that your side is visible.
Cheers!
Hey @abh12345,
first of - I didn't upvote myself for the rewards but to make a statement since you mentioned smartsteem in your post and I believe that the response is important enough that it shouldn't be buried under all the other ones.
Now - I also don't take it as an attack, it's just that you made clear that you're not a fan of delegating for profit. Which I can understand - but I don't believe that his is any significant risk to STEEM as plattform for content.
The far bigger risk are big stackholders who are upvoting each other in circles.
Upvote-Services on the other hand, give everyone the chance to also get visibility.
Also - smartsteem.com is NOT just another bid-bot, but a whole plattform with the goal of empowering quality content.
I understand it was not for profit.
Sadly this cannot be stopped, its 'proof of stake' here and we cannot help with this.
You need money for bid-bots, not everyone has this. And so it is the case that good posts (30-60$), are not as high up in the hot/trending as the ones voted by the creator, that do not not match this quality.
I would still like your views on what you think Steemit would look like if everyone chose to delegate to a bid-bot.
Personally, I think it would be a case of the richest person wins, and hope that's not what you wish for this platform.
Big props to you guys for implementing white list and I hope in the future the service goes white list exclusive for the vote selling side. I want to note I flagged your comment solely so that another comment from @techslut which I feel is some amazingly succinct advice for Steem beginners rose to the top here - not my intention to get into a flag war. Hopefully no hard feelings. I am curious though - you don't think that further increasing the wealth inequality on platform (which vote selling services that purchase SP delegation from whales cannot help but doing - they funnel funds from minnows up into the pockets of the biggest whales) is bad for Steem? I personally feel it is the single biggest issue facing Steem today. Welcome respectful debate.
FLAG WAARRR!
Yeah, not a chance. I've stuff to do.
But allow me to give my 0.05 SBD on the topic of vote buying.
I am not a fan of it. At all. But it's there, and it will continue to be there. Disclaimer: I work with Buildteam, who run minnowbooster.
There is a lot of room for improving the way vote buying bots work. Yes, whitelisting and a strict anti-abuse policy are a good start, but it's not enough. As long as the system permits it, delegations will be leased and votes will be sold. I don't think it's the biggest issue. There are numerous ones. Power centralization is, without a doubt, a bigger problem. With better power distribution between the users of the platform, there simple would be no demand for vote buying services.
@carlgnash
I understand.
I don't believe in funnelings rewards from minnows to whales - since many of the sellers are actually minnows.
However, it is true that people with more power, get more rewards.
In the real world and also here on STEEM.
When someone gets so greedy that they only want for themselves even though they already have so much - then that is indeed not good.
But let's take me as an example.
I'm currently selling votes and upvoting other posts on a 50/50 basis - at least that's what I think; haven't made any calculations yet.
And I don't see any problems with that. I like to give, but I also see the importance of growing my own Steempower as only then I can be free to give to others.
So it’s more lucrative to delegate to a voting bot then curating? If that’s the case it moves Steemit in a direction that makes it even harder for new accounts to gain traction. It’s amazing that the voting bots consistently book up and overbook when the results are clearly to the benefit of the bot and not the author. Thanks for the post!
Much more lucrative.
But then all we'll have is self-voted, bought posts and the rest somewhere in the blockchain, requiring a good search party!
The difference between those who live on the old banker usury rules vs those who choose to live with prosperity, gifting and love. It is our duty to help others be prosperous. I have no need for my steem right now, so why not let others use it. Besides, my own growth as an author comes from others who vote for me. The Stewards of Terra Mater tend to upvote a lot of my posts and they pay it forward as well. Win / win as far as I'm concerned. Besides, all the steem is gifted. So support the gifting economy by giving!!!
Certainly, and i'm sure you don't mean in relation to just financial wealth.
Yes I left a small not in the post stating I don't ask for votes from delegates, although most of them drop by often - it really is a win/win if you set your stall out right.
As you say, we are in a gift economy, lets make it happen!
I find that if we just focus on the financial then we will always be dependent on the financial. However, if we teach and support one another to be independent, then we don't need the financial system. That is prosperity!
Feed a man a fish, feed him for a day. The financial, economic and government systems function on this principle.
Teach a man how to fish, you feed him for a life time. The gifting economy that we are learning how to build here functions on that level! At least that is what I speak about very often!
You are correct my friend and dear brother. Bravo
I missed a reply to this comment amongst the flurry of other responses, my aplogies.
Yes you are quite right, and this is why I too mention delegation and engagement often.
This is our chance to promote the gift economy and the 'right' way to Steemit, we are doing our bit :)
Thank you for all your comments this evening, a pleasure to interact as always.
There are those who sell off what little influence they have in this world for whatever the market will bare for short term profits. Then there are those who use their influence to shape the world around them looking to make long term gains.
It’s a bit silly trying making a few percentage of an ROI from dividends when your total value drops by 50% in a month and thinking you are getting ahead in life. They could have been trying shape and make it worthwhile peoples times who could take Steem to $100, or even $1000+ one day. Kind of hard to see those thing coming true with hard working and people who do make a chance here get pissed off and give up because they are not willing to spend insane amounts of money just to get any attention.
Which is why I’m thankful for people who want to play the long term game of focusing on area they want to see better on Steemit. When people come here form YouTube and other places they notice our comment sections are not a dumpster fire trying drag you down with it. It's a place for community to grow like it should be.
Thank you @enjar
Some great points.
I think we have years to go yet on this Blockchain, and it's my child's future I'm looking at as much as anything. 1-2-5 years is short term, 10-20 now we are talking!
Thanks gain for your comments, i'm sorry mine are short - it's been a busy week in the replies for me!
Ahh yes this is why I delegate SP! I just love the platform, I figure it will return in some way in the end. Really, I just love helping people to and giving them joy, and I can now give easily without losing really anything at all. The ability to give is what I love the most haha.
Brilliant :)
I feel the same - it's a little out of hope more than judgement, but that's fine when I receive a bunch of supporting comments and know others are doing the same.
Good luck to you, and well done for taking this road less travelled with me :)
I am indeed a pathfinder, literally and figuratively :P
Awesome explanation Asher! Its so great to walk through the numbers and see what we all know to be true.
The answer to your question is it depends on your purpose of being here. You are stupid if you think this platform is going to be just another failed experiment that ends up like Myspace. If that's the case, taking the money and running is the solution.
But if you believe this is the place that will eventually surpass the corporate driven likes of facebook, youtube, and instagram; then you are not stupid but brilliant. The funny thing people should be asking themselves is "why am I here?".
If it is to make a quick buck, then you are wasting your time. There is no way to live off the scraps that we get right now with STEEM so high in price.
If it is to spend your time and invest your efforts into building a community, then you will be not stupid, but a hero if the people at the top ever figure it out.
They need you (and your awesome followers), they just haven't realized yet how important you and your fellow delegators (for free) are yet.
In my opinion, they will learn when the "hot money" comes out of the crypto space. I think it will happen someday soon too. Then they will realize that they may "lose it all" if they don't figure out how to take care of the little guys too.
ps... You can add @simplymike to your list with a nice 100SP delegation to @friendsofgondor!
Thanks Dave
I shall add @simplymike to the list right away...
OK, that's done. Thanks for the tagline comp. by the way, hope we see some action there!
The numbers help show I guess what a sacrifice it is. As you know, I don't ask for votes, and if the delegatee thinks my post isn't worth a vote, I don't expect one just because!
Building communities is the key, building people up around you as we've spoken about before - setting as many people free as possible, together - I hear it's a lonely place alone.
Thank you for continually wafting my name in front of the big players, maybe when the SBD price resets, they may come looking for the curation approach again.
Thank you for all you do, a flying start you've had and carrying many newbies along too!
Awesome on adding @simplymike!
And you're welcome on the tagline competition and I'm sure we will see some good action ;). I don't think I was clear though in my post because we also have a logo contest too with @beeyou, if you haven't seen it (Click here)
I agree with you completely about building communities and I am so glad that you opened up your community to us. We are starting to blend together in so many ways and I think the bonds get stronger by the day!
Yes the price of STEEM and SBD are the keys that will change the way of thinking (imho). Right now it is something they are not worried about, but when the reset comes they will learn how valuable you and your ideas really are. The people we work with should stay patient and just keep doing what they do best which is engagement! It will pay off big if certain things go right!
You're welcome of course, but its the least we can do for you. You have welcomed us with open arms and given a lift to so many! I'm glad we can all work together! :)
Earlier today, I read this post by @spiritualmax on how free delegations are still a little bit selfish. It was an interesting read.
Top 3 Selfish Reasons to Delegate: Help Someone, Help Yourself!
Yay @simplymike! That is generous of you to delegate SP to the @friendsofgondor account.
You know, I see a lot of paying it forward gestures with our newbieresteemday members. Not that I'm bragging or anything..... Ok, just a bit. :)
Its ok to brag on your teammates, that's what cheerleaders do!!! ;) and check out @simplymike's cheer above ... :)
I will go read it... I like @spiritualmax and he has a killer idea about bringing all the open groups together and joining together loosely. We have joined that now and have traded rooms (or embasseys as he calls them) in each other's servers. Someone suggested you to be our "official" ambassador to the Crypto Empire, I think that is a great idea if you would be interested! (I was waiting for you to recover before I thrust you into something new) ;) ...
If you want to check it out and talk with @spiritualmax about it, I'm sure he would love to talk with you!!! Here is the link if you want to stop in and bless them with your presence! ;)
https://discord.gg/qgSvHsw
and here's a newbie nickel just because you are back and I'm so happy about it! (brought to you be @danielasori) ... ps I will limit it to 3 on a post this blog so I don't hog up too much space, so you along with the killers Bs get it tonight (@bashadow and @beeyou)...
Thanks @davemccoy.
I noticed he had reached out for the #newbieresteemday initiative, and already took a peek at his fort on Discord yesterday.
I’m flattered by the idea that someone suggested I could become the ‘ambassador’, but it’s way too soon for me to commit to something. I have at least 1,5 month of recovery ahead and during this time I can not be sure I’ll be able to drop in on a regular base.
I’m sure there are quite a number of other people that would gladly take up this role. Meanwhile, I’m satisfied with my role as a cheerleader ;0)
haha... very fun @simplymike!!! I understand and want you to do what you do best! :D (btw you are a fantastic cheerleader too!!!) ;)
I'll hold off on making you our ambassador, but I want you to know that in my eyes you can have any title you want. So in the future just say the words and you can be whatever you want!
I hope you continue with your recovery, I love seeing you out here and doing such positive things! You're amazing!!!
Thanks @davemccoy. You always manage to stun me with your kind words, which makes me wonder how to reply - lol.
Keep up doing what you’re doing, ‘cos you’re doing an amazing job :0)
P.s.: I’ll keep it in mind, thanks!
Same back at ya! I see things you do and I'm truly amazed!
And this is why we are here. We are trying to make a difference and make Steemit the best platform for content and engagement!
Exactly Mav! We may each have different ideas about how to do it, but we have much more in common with each other than not. That's why I love waking up every day! Its a chance to make a difference (what more can we ask for?)
True it's a chance to become better version of ourselves each day.
I'm excited to help you out and be part of the people who make Steemit such a great place
I also know of others that make free delegations for the purpose(s) of spreading the rewards more broadly into the Steempool, encouraging particular creators, and more besides. I'll not name names as @aggroed (oops!) and others are competent to blow their own horns, should they want to.
I know that @aggroed has mentioned his delegations elsewhere, so I reckon I'm not revealing secrets in his case, while others may be less interested in having their trumpets sounded.
I have long and strongly approved of these kinds of delegations as being most potential to more broadly disseminate SP to worthy minnows whose success will put upwards pressure on Steem, creating a rising tide that floats all wallets.
While profitability of bidbots seems a slamdunk, at least for the short term, ignoring the long term effects of controlling the rewards pool for the purpose of profiteering, on a social media platform originally intended to reward quality content and human interaction, neglects the long term profit potential of rising Steem price. That is a far more emunerative potential for investors, as BTC showed this past year.
Thanks for proving my point that it's neither foolish to support folks that support the price of Steem from a financial standpoint, nor to strengthen the community we all love!
How could I forget @aggroed, thanks for the reminder there!
I'm just going to copy this paragraph out as it's an absolute winner and I certainly didn't say it better myself!
At times during the writing of the post I thought about doing something else as I felt quite hypocritical. As you know I've been a fairly regular user of Bots, and even delegated small amounts to @aggroed's bots in the past. Around the start of the year I contacted him stating I was cancelling the lease, and of course he had no issue - 'It's your Steem Power!' Cool.
My view is that they are here for a while longer yet, and come as part of the package as far as delegating to the projects currently advancing the Blockchain.
However, they are abused with huge votes (my biggest was the other day and was to promote the awesome people who were listed, actually producing more comments than the vote-bots for 2018 thus far. The post had hit 50 replies before I chose to do this - the submission wasn't coordinated with the timing of a voting round, like so many do. These post looks rushed because they are - got to finish it before 'appreciator' voting round finishes!
They aren't going anywhere for now, but their longevity could perhaps be shortened it they weren't fueled by SP and this off-pegged SBD price.
It was a shame to see another whale, particular a manual curator, join the club but I don't blame him looking at the returns.
Anyway, I shall continue leasing more SP out as I earn it, as I did again today and hope for the best!
Thank you!
I have long been impressed with @thejohalfiles manual curation, in an environment that certainly must exert a strong suction on his stake towards more potentially immediately profitable endeavors.
I realized early on that prudent investors need to mind their stakes, and cannot find fault that they do so. I just consider the potential returns from an appreciating Steem to so outweigh any that can be wrested from delegation fees or bot payments that it seems utterly short sighted to fail to coordinate as a group (the whales) and undertake delegations (as @fulltimegeek showed work very well to encourage the delegates, and those they engage with) which will improve account retention, and uplift Steem price.
I do not criticize your choices. You make them as you will. I hope my meta-discussion of the issue doesn't make you feel that I do.
Were that my intent, I am sure you have noted that I can speak plainly =p
Yes I agree, it is their stake and so the choice is theirs only. As far as encouragement and engagement, only one winner though!
Yes I understand, and have read elsewhere in the past, words are not there to be minced at times :) I think I remember you up-voting the self-goat 'bot' that follows a minnowbooster vote one time, and so that's why I'm on my toes :)